Sue Bourne
Sue Bourne is an award winning documentary filmmaker who has found success with the likes of Cutting Edge, Mum and Me and Naked Britain.
But this week sees her step into cinema for the very first time with her new documentary Jig, which tells the compelling story of the 40th Irish Dancing World Championships.
I caught up with Sue to talk about the new movie, taking on a feature film for the first time and what lies ahead for her.
- Jig is about to be released here in the UK so can you tell me a little bit about the movie?
Jig is the story of the 40th Irish Dancing World Championships that were held in Glasgow last year - thousands of dancers descended on Scotland to compete for this coveted world title.
So we began the year before trying to get access to film them and then eventually we got access - no one had been allowed in before to do any filming - we managed to persuade them in the end. We did all our research, we went all around the world to find the best people and the best stories and then we filmed them - all around the world.
We then filmed for the duration of the world championships, which was a huge big team of people, and then we made the film (laughs).
- I read that you knew nothing about the world of Irish Dancing so where did the idea for the movie come from and why did you jump at the chance to make this documentary?
No not at all. It was a journalist who had seen my films and liked them and thought I could do a good job of Irish Dancing; she was a former Irish Dancer herself. She came to me and asked me if I knew anything about it and would I be interested - I said 'No, not really' (laughs).
But actually it's fascinating because you don't know anything about it and it would be like opening a door and looking at this world that no one knows anything about - competitions are always good because you get all the tension.
What I liked about it was from my point of view it was a global phenomenon - it's very rarely you come across a subject that you think this could work internationally; not many films do.
I wanted to make a film and I thought this is it I have found it - a film that could be a feature film that has global possibilities as well as being an appealing world. It's a bit like My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding in the fact that it has got big frocks, big hair, they spend a lot of money on their costumes and they are tight knit little families and no one know anything about them.
That was all very appealing, this was well before Gypsy Weddings, so for me, as a filmmaker, it was opening a door and going into a world I knew nothing about, and that is always interesting.
Beyond the dresses and the wigs I liked the fact that it was a bit beauty pageantry because you think 'oh that's a big concerning' or 'that's a bit controversial' but once you get in they fall by the wayside because what you are then watching is talent and dedication. For me it was about families, sacrifice and incredibly hard working children and I found it fascinating once I had got into that world and started digging deeper.
- And Irish Dancing is perhaps a world that nothing much is known about so how easy was it to find a way into this world - were people very willing to let you make this movie?
The world championships are run by An Coimisiún, which is an international body which rules a huge section of Irish Dancing; it runs the competitions and the champions and sets the rules and regulations, and they had never given permission for an outsider to come in and make a film - so that was hurdle number one.
That took a lot of persuasion because they had various reasons. And we did our research into what it was the objected to and why no one had got in before and then we tackled each of the objections.
One of the objections that they to it was they wanted to protect the choreography of the steps, so that's what they had never let cameras in before, but today people had mobile phones so within minutes they can be up on YouTube - so that objection had gone really.
I think because there is a bit of controversy about the way they dress, it is a bit beauty pageantry, I think there attitude is just to not let outsiders in to make fun of them or criticism them - so they were wary of an outside coming in for that reason.
The impact of Riverdance and Michael Flatley is probably starting to wear off - those shows and Flatley led to an enormous explosion in Irish Dancing because everyone fell in love with it and wanted to learn how to do it.
But it's fifteen plus years ago since that first happened and the impact of that is wearing off so they were looking for another injection to tell the world about Irish Dancing.
And then I suppose I came along, and without making too much about it, if an award winning filmmaker comes along and says I want to make a film you have to think 'well it's got a better chance of reaching a wider market with her'.
They had seen my films and liked me and I just said 'You have to trust me. I make films that are honest and true and you are going to have to take a big punt'
Because they were saying 'well we can control it' and I said: 'Absolutely not! I come in and make the film that I want to make with total freedom and if you are not willing to accept that then it won't happen'. And they were like 'ok', opened the door and let me in and never interfered at all.
- The movie follows these young kids through hours of training as well as talking to families and teacher over a period of two years so what were the difficulties that you faced during the filming process?
We spent a lot of time doing our research we talk to people and get to know them as we try to work out what are the best stories.
Jig is ninety three minutes long so you can't have stories that are telling you the same thing you need variety and you need each of the characters to bring something different to the film.
You start researching it and very soon you start hearing about the interesting stories or you know that you find interesting - so that took us a long time.
Then we were ready to film, by then everyone knew me and my associate producer really well, and than was just a mammoth task - the four of us went round the world together filming with them before the competition.
Then we went to the competition, that's nine intense days of fifteen hour day - we would be there with them when they got up in the morning and follow them through the day right up to the results.
- Jig shows that this is a very competitive world - one woman says that she didn't care if her daughter could read or write - how taken aback were you by the level of competitiveness?
With anything when you are at the top it's competitive - you can take swimmers, tennis players, golfers anything - so I don't think that Irish Dancing is any more or less than any other sport or art form that's competitive at that level, they want to win.
What I find really interesting about Irish Dancing is it's not about financial gain; with tennis protégés or golf protégés there is always a bit pot of money and I think that's where you find parents who sometimes push their children because their child has a talent and the parents can see the money at the end of it, this is the opposite of that.
There is no money in it at all - all there is is poverty and sacrifice for the parents because they have to pay and they ain’t going to get any money.
When I said to people that I was doing this movie they said 'lots of pushy parents' but I thought you can not push your child to do what these kids do if the child doesn't want to do it. Ten year olds doing three or four hours a day - you couldn't make your child do that because it's hard and physical work.
It's as if the dance casts a spell over these children. There's a wee boy in it called John and he has five brothers who all played football - but John wanted to dance and it was like it was in his soul he just couldn't be stopped. Where did that come from? There's no Irish, there's no connection it was just in his soul and that seemed to be the way with a lot of people that we met.
- You said that you knew very little about Irish Dancing before Jig so what have you learnt during putting this film together?
I am not a dancer. I was kicked out of ballet school at the age of four the teacher told my mother not to waste her money. I have two left feet; I have no rhythm so I didn't really get it.
I watched some of the dances in this film, one in particular he is one of the best dancers in the world and two minutes on his feet and my jaw drops - he is just mesmerising. I never thought that that would happen to me, but it did.
- You have been behind a whole host of documentary projects over the years so what is it about this genre of film that you love so much?
Any film that I do I spend a long time on it, this has taken three or four times longer than usual because it's a much big scale; it's a feature film and not just for telly, and I have to be curious about it and I have to be fascinated about what I am about to do and what I am about to find out.
But what I think I love more than anything, what motivates me, I like being with ordinary people but I like finding the extraordinary in those people - if I was to say what motivates me it would be that because everyone has got a story and everybody has something of interest to say you just have to look and find it.
- Jig is your first feature length documentary for the big screen so how did you find the transition into cinema?
Fascinating. It's terrific to be at my age and my stage in my career to do something completely new - it was new and you do have to work differently. The scale of film is different, the way you shoot it is different, the way you edit it is different and it was just fantastic.
At my age I was learning masses and I was on this very steep learning curve and it's been fascinating. I would love to do it again - I have got a bit of a taste for it.
- Finally what's next for you?
I do have two new films and I would love to get funding for them and try and get them off the ground. But at the moment I'm just trying to get Jig out. Hopefully if Jug does well then it might help me get the next big project so that's what my hope is.
Jig is released 6th May.
FemaleFirst Helen Earnshaw
Sue Bourne is an award winning documentary filmmaker who has found success with the likes of Cutting Edge, Mum and Me and Naked Britain.
But this week sees her step into cinema for the very first time with her new documentary Jig, which tells the compelling story of the 40th Irish Dancing World Championships.
I caught up with Sue to talk about the new movie, taking on a feature film for the first time and what lies ahead for her.
- Jig is about to be released here in the UK so can you tell me a little bit about the movie?
Jig is the story of the 40th Irish Dancing World Championships that were held in Glasgow last year - thousands of dancers descended on Scotland to compete for this coveted world title.
So we began the year before trying to get access to film them and then eventually we got access - no one had been allowed in before to do any filming - we managed to persuade them in the end. We did all our research, we went all around the world to find the best people and the best stories and then we filmed them - all around the world.
We then filmed for the duration of the world championships, which was a huge big team of people, and then we made the film (laughs).
- I read that you knew nothing about the world of Irish Dancing so where did the idea for the movie come from and why did you jump at the chance to make this documentary?
No not at all. It was a journalist who had seen my films and liked them and thought I could do a good job of Irish Dancing; she was a former Irish Dancer herself. She came to me and asked me if I knew anything about it and would I be interested - I said 'No, not really' (laughs).
But actually it's fascinating because you don't know anything about it and it would be like opening a door and looking at this world that no one knows anything about - competitions are always good because you get all the tension.
What I liked about it was from my point of view it was a global phenomenon - it's very rarely you come across a subject that you think this could work internationally; not many films do.
I wanted to make a film and I thought this is it I have found it - a film that could be a feature film that has global possibilities as well as being an appealing world. It's a bit like My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding in the fact that it has got big frocks, big hair, they spend a lot of money on their costumes and they are tight knit little families and no one know anything about them.
That was all very appealing, this was well before Gypsy Weddings, so for me, as a filmmaker, it was opening a door and going into a world I knew nothing about, and that is always interesting.
Beyond the dresses and the wigs I liked the fact that it was a bit beauty pageantry because you think 'oh that's a big concerning' or 'that's a bit controversial' but once you get in they fall by the wayside because what you are then watching is talent and dedication. For me it was about families, sacrifice and incredibly hard working children and I found it fascinating once I had got into that world and started digging deeper.
- And Irish Dancing is perhaps a world that nothing much is known about so how easy was it to find a way into this world - were people very willing to let you make this movie?
The world championships are run by An Coimisiún, which is an international body which rules a huge section of Irish Dancing; it runs the competitions and the champions and sets the rules and regulations, and they had never given permission for an outsider to come in and make a film - so that was hurdle number one.
That took a lot of persuasion because they had various reasons. And we did our research into what it was the objected to and why no one had got in before and then we tackled each of the objections.
One of the objections that they to it was they wanted to protect the choreography of the steps, so that's what they had never let cameras in before, but today people had mobile phones so within minutes they can be up on YouTube - so that objection had gone really.
I think because there is a bit of controversy about the way they dress, it is a bit beauty pageantry, I think there attitude is just to not let outsiders in to make fun of them or criticism them - so they were wary of an outside coming in for that reason.
The impact of Riverdance and Michael Flatley is probably starting to wear off - those shows and Flatley led to an enormous explosion in Irish Dancing because everyone fell in love with it and wanted to learn how to do it.