The most powerful military powers

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myron myron
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Postby myron myron on Mon Feb 04, 2008 11:40 pm

The Colonel wrote:
myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:Another point...

Who supported the US post 9/11?

Russia? No.
China? No.
France? No.
Germany? No.

(France and Germany only have a token force in Afghanistan because they have no choice under NATO treaties)

Who did?

The United Kingdom,
Australia,
Poland. (Only sent about 1,000 to Iraq in the early days)

Three nations, two of which are Realms of the British Crown.

Perhaps you should realise who your friends are before you insult them.

I don't insult my friends.

To the extent you believe I insult you, that should tell you something. :lol:


Face it, you're bigoted.

You only dislike me because I'm anti-religious. But you know what I say is true.

I dislike you because you are an admitted liar and an admitted bigot.

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Postby myron myron on Mon Feb 04, 2008 11:48 pm

The Colonel wrote:
myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:You are the one who is showing bigotry towards the UK myron, not the other way around.

Your supercarrier argument is correct...however Kitty Hawk, Enterprise, Carl Vinson and Dwight. D. Eisenhower are almost ready for decomission. (Kitty Hawk has a matter of weeks left). I acknowledge there are SOME replacements planned but these are not enough to cover the amount the carrier fleet has decreased already.

Nevertheless, the UK is developing three - very large - stealth carriers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier

See above for a guide, though I have to say a fair bit of that information is inaccurate to what I know. For example, it mentions peace time aircraft rather than full capacity, and mentions only two of the three that have been ordered.


The United States government conducted a study and decided on a policy of maintaining 10 nuclear-powered supercarrier battle groups deployed at all times. No nuclear-powered supercarrier will be decomissioned until a new nuclear-powered supercarrier is commissioned.

Maybe not, but still, many of them are very old. Kitty Hawk has weeks left.

Can you cite a single reputable source that ranks the UK military second in the world? Of course not.

Probably not, it's not exactly something easy when the information is not widely in the public domain. The information you have been reading is misleading and inaccurate. As a HMI I know of the strength of the military and you severely underestimate it!
It is a fact that the UK does not have the capability to exert military power globally.

Russia has first strike nuclear capability over the UK, i.e., Russia can destroy the UK with a nuclear strike and Russia can survive. Russia has ICBMs and long-range strategic bombers. And Russia has produced new jet fighters more advanced than anything Britian has.

You see, this is where you are so misled. Britain, has a large stock of missiles, which we made ourselves (something you deny). We have the ability to destroy any nation with our missiles. Think about it, how many does it take to do enough damage? In reality, under 10. If you knew anything, you'd realise that no nation can survive many nuclear strikes.

Britain has ICBM's, what is wrong with you? We also have long range bombers, the developmental bombers are unbelievable. Russia has few modern fighters and they are NOTHING compared to the new Eurofighter and Lightning II. Once again, you are wrong.



China can overwhelm the UK with sheer numbers.

True, but it could the US as well if you want to think on those terms.

And of course all the factors analyzed in GlobalFirepower's rankings are relevant to military strength.

It was a VERY poor analysis.

No country with Britain's population, GDP and military budget can be a global superpower in the 21st century.

That is where you are wrong. We don't aim to be a superpower as such, we do try and aim for peace before war after all! Dare I suggest the US aims for war then peace?! We are, like it or not, the second most powerful nation on the planet.

There is a good reason why you have not cited any reputable sources for your claims: they are bullshit.

And as I've stated numerous times: I love the Brits, but you are an exception because you are an admitted liar, an admitted bigot, and an embarrassment to your country and its officer corps.

Change the record. So much of what you have cited is absolute rubbish. You do not love the Brits. If you did, you'd acknowledge our actual power. You should also be grateful we are on your side. I've met many Americans, military and civilian, and I have to say the military officers were horrendous. One American commander, who I was with at the time in Bosnia, nearly killed hundreds of allied soliders and UN officials by calling an air strike to the wrong place.

When you've gone and fought myron, you'll have a valid opinion.




Your word alone, without reputable sources, means nothing.

We don't know anything about you: who you are, what you do, what you've done in life; only what you claim.

What we do know is that you have admitted being a liar and that you have admitted being a bigot in this forum.

Look up falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus -- that describes your credibility.

By the way, you can't have a "stealth" aircraft carrier that is not nuclear-powered and does not carry stealth airplanes.

Last edited by myron myron on Tue Feb 05, 2008 3:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby The Colonel on Tue Feb 05, 2008 12:36 am

myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:
myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:Another point...

Who supported the US post 9/11?

Russia? No.
China? No.
France? No.
Germany? No.

(France and Germany only have a token force in Afghanistan because they have no choice under NATO treaties)

Who did?

The United Kingdom,
Australia,
Poland. (Only sent about 1,000 to Iraq in the early days)

Three nations, two of which are Realms of the British Crown.

Perhaps you should realise who your friends are before you insult them.

I don't insult my friends.

To the extent you believe I insult you, that should tell you something. :lol:


Face it, you're bigoted.

You only dislike me because I'm anti-religious. But you know what I say is true.

I dislike you because you are an admitted liar and an admitted bigot.


I only ever lie to trolls, and as I've said, you CANNOT BE BIGOTTED TO MYTHOLOGY!

When will you get that around your bag of blow?
"Evolution is the process of change, from one generation to the next, of inherited characteristics. The microbiologists see it happening all the time, as bacteria evolve to beat the antibiotics that we have so painstakingly developed."

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myron myron
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Postby myron myron on Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:59 am

The Colonel wrote:I only ever lie to trolls, and as I've said, you CANNOT BE BIGOTTED TO MYTHOLOGY!

Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus, i.e., credibility and integrity are not susceptible of partial diminution.

And a bigot is a bigot, regardless of the target of his bigotry.


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Postby The Colonel on Tue Feb 05, 2008 2:19 pm

myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:I only ever lie to trolls, and as I've said, you CANNOT BE BIGOTTED TO MYTHOLOGY!

Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus, i.e., credibility and integrity are not susceptible of partial diminution.

And a bigot is a bigot, regardless of the target of his bigotry.



Therefore, a druggy is a druggy regardless of all else.
"Evolution is the process of change, from one generation to the next, of inherited characteristics. The microbiologists see it happening all the time, as bacteria evolve to beat the antibiotics that we have so painstakingly developed."

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myron myron
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Postby myron myron on Tue Feb 05, 2008 2:54 pm

The Colonel wrote:
myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:I only ever lie to trolls, and as I've said, you CANNOT BE BIGOTTED TO MYTHOLOGY!

Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus, i.e., credibility and integrity are not susceptible of partial diminution.

And a bigot is a bigot, regardless of the target of his bigotry.


Therefore, a druggy is a druggy regardless of all else.

A "druggy" can stop and become an ex-druggy, but a liar and a bigot is beyond redemption.


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Postby The Colonel on Tue Feb 05, 2008 2:58 pm

myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:
myron myron wrote:
The Colonel wrote:I only ever lie to trolls, and as I've said, you CANNOT BE BIGOTTED TO MYTHOLOGY!

Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus, i.e., credibility and integrity are not susceptible of partial diminution.

And a bigot is a bigot, regardless of the target of his bigotry.


Therefore, a druggy is a druggy regardless of all else.

A "druggy" can stop and become an ex-druggy, but a liar and a bigot is beyond redemption.



No, the good old British saying from the 80's "once a druggy, always a druggy".

Liars and bigots can change myron...that's why religious people become atheists! :P
"Evolution is the process of change, from one generation to the next, of inherited characteristics. The microbiologists see it happening all the time, as bacteria evolve to beat the antibiotics that we have so painstakingly developed."

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Postby Death From Above 1993 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 3:54 pm

The Red Army of Russia and the PLA of China both have more troops than the U.S. Army, not to mention Russia's strength in the nuclear missile department - Best in the world. I seriously doubt that any country could survive a first-strike by Russia followed by a full invasion of their troops.

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Postby myron myron on Tue Feb 05, 2008 4:56 pm


No country in the world has nuclear first strike capability against the United States. The American TRIAD system has made sure of that for decades. The TRIAD consists of three nuclear prongs, by land, sea and air: (1) ICBMs in hardened underground missile silos throughout the United States and ICBMs in constant motion by train and truck throughout the United States; (2) ICBMs in nuclear-powered submarines deployed throughout the world, and, (3) ICBMs on long-range strategic bombers in the air 24/7/365 (though this prong has been curtailed from time to time when unnecessary). There is no way any country can destroy the United States with a nuclear first strike and eliminate all three prongs of the TRIAD before being destroyed itself. This concept, called Mutual Assured Destruction (MAD), is what effectively deterred a nuclear war between the U.S. and the Soviet Union during the Cold War.

The main reason the Soviet Union disintegrated without a single shot being fired was Ronald Reagan's decision to fund every weapons system on the drawing boards at the time he became President and, most importantly, to fund research and development for an anti-ballistic missile (ABM) defense. If and when the United States developed an effective ABM system, the Americans would have clear first strike capability against the Soviet Union and MAD would no longer apply. The Soviets couldn't keep up with the Americans economically and their inefficient economic system started tearing apart at the seams and rotting from a weak foundation, which caused the Soviet political system to implode and the Soviet Union to disintegrate.

Even now, with the Soviet Union a memory, it is questionable that the United States has nuclear first strike capability against Russia. There is no doubt, however, that neither Russia nor China nor any other country has nuclear first strike capability against the United States.

In terms of conventional military power, Russia may have a quantitative advantage over America in certain weapons systems and China unquestionably has a quantitative advantage in manpower. But America's huge quantitative and qualitative advantage in key weapons systems and sufficient manpower to operate these advanced systems totally nullify China's quantitative advantage in manpower and Russia's quantitative advantage in certain weapons systems.

America is by far the most powerful nation in the history of the world primarily owing to 10 American nuclear-powered Supercarrier Battle Groups deployed throughout the world at all times. Each supercarrier is like a floating air base carrying 85 planes. No other country has even a single nuclear-powered supercarrier or plans to build one. But for American Supercarrier Battle Groups on constant patrol in the . Ocean, China would have invaded and annexed Taiwan long ago. That China does not dare attack Taiwan is proof positive that China recognizes America's military superiority.


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Postby The Colonel on Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:16 pm

Death From Above 1993 wrote:The Red Army of Russia and the PLA of China both have more troops than the U.S. Army, not to mention Russia's strength in the nuclear missile department - Best in the world. I seriously doubt that any country could survive a first-strike by Russia followed by a full invasion of their troops.


The Russian military is completely out of date, including their nuclear weapons.
"Evolution is the process of change, from one generation to the next, of inherited characteristics. The microbiologists see it happening all the time, as bacteria evolve to beat the antibiotics that we have so painstakingly developed."

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Postby The Colonel on Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:15 pm

myron myron wrote:
No country in the world has nuclear first strike capability against the United States. The American TRIAD system has made sure of that for decades. The TRIAD consists of three nuclear prongs, by land, sea and air: (1) ICBMs in hardened underground missile silos throughout the United States and ICBMs in constant motion by train and truck throughout the United States; (2) ICBMs in nuclear-powered submarines deployed throughout the world, and, (3) ICBMs on long-range strategic bombers in the air 24/7/365 (though this prong has been curtailed from time to time when unnecessary). There is no way any country can destroy the United States with a nuclear first strike and eliminate all three prongs of the TRIAD before being destroyed itself. This concept, called Mutual Assured Destruction (MAD), is what effectively deterred a nuclear war between the U.S. and the Soviet Union during the Cold War.

The main reason the Soviet Union disintegrated without a single shot being fired was Ronald Reagan's decision to fund every weapons system on the drawing boards at the time he became President and, most importantly, to fund research and development for an anti-ballistic missile (ABM) defense. If and when the United States developed an effective ABM system, the Americans would have clear first strike capability against the Soviet Union and MAD would no longer apply. The Soviets couldn't keep up with the Americans economically and their inefficient economic system started tearing apart at the seams and rotting from a weak foundation, which caused the Soviet political system to implode and the Soviet Union to disintegrate.

Even now, with the Soviet Union a memory, it is questionable that the United States has nuclear first strike capability against Russia. There is no doubt, however, that neither Russia nor China nor any other country has nuclear first strike capability against the United States.

In terms of conventional military power, Russia may have a quantitative advantage over America in certain weapons systems and China unquestionably has a quantitative advantage in manpower. But America's huge quantitative and qualitative advantage in key weapons systems and sufficient manpower to operate these advanced systems totally nullify China's quantitative advantage in manpower and Russia's quantitative advantage in certain weapons systems.

America is by far the most powerful nation in the history of the world primarily owing to 10 American nuclear-powered Supercarrier Battle Groups deployed throughout the world at all times. Each supercarrier is like a floating air base carrying 85 planes. No other country has even a single nuclear-powered supercarrier or plans to build one. But for American Supercarrier Battle Groups on constant patrol in the . Ocean, China would have invaded and annexed Taiwan long ago. That China does not dare attack Taiwan is proof positive that China recognizes America's military superiority.



Perhaps you should remember the following also:

The UK has the ability to launch nuclear weapons, and not just on mainland Britain.

The UK (since the end of the Cold War) retains at least 2 nuclear submarines (with ICBM's) at sea at all times.

Our Carriers carry nuclear weapons that can be deployed from aircraft, one of our carriers is at sea at all times.

(The reason we do not have more "defence" is because at present it is not needed, the Cold War is over etc)

Until just recently, we scaled back our airborne defence (i.e. planes in the sky at all times with nuclear weapons). Since Russia started flying bombers in our zones a few months back we have restarted doing so. At least 6 aircraft are in the air with nuclear weapons.

Now, I expect the criticisms will be these:

- We don't have many nuclear weapons:

Well, we have 230, with a futher 200 on order! (From a British company myron!) Further, that number of nukes could destroy any nation.

- We don't have much nuclear force deployed at any one time:

True, but 32 (16 per submarine) are kept on submarine "watch", at least a few on the aircraft carriers, and 2 per aircraft in the sky. Whichever way you look at it - that is a serious force.

However, if it was ever needed, we could have 20 submarines, all our carriers and most of our long range aircraft carrying them.
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Postby Bushwalker on Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:48 pm

I found it strange that Indonesia was so far up in that list...

It has Indonesia with a bigger economy than Australia's, when the reality is that Indonesia crashed during the 1980's, and - largely due to corrupt government and military, and too many people - it's economy is now less than 40% the size of Australia's.
The only way I could imagine them having the kind of purchasing power that that list implies, would be to sell a lot of their (accessible..) petroleum reserves in one hit..

That list also fails to take into account Indonesia's failing and collapsing infrastructure; and their inability to maintain the military resources that they have.

(It also has Australia's GDP at about 70% of this year's level - so this dates some of the info' it uses on there..).

As for the USA's "supercarriers", don't forget they also have two fixed 'carriers as well - Japan and Australia..
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Postby The Colonel on Thu Feb 07, 2008 3:39 pm

Bushwalker wrote:I found it strange that Indonesia was so far up in that list...

It has Indonesia with a bigger economy than Australia's, when the reality is that Indonesia crashed during the 1980's, and - largely due to corrupt government and military, and too many people - it's economy is now less than 40% the size of Australia's.
The only way I could imagine them having the kind of purchasing power that that list implies, would be to sell a lot of their (accessible..) petroleum reserves in one hit..

That list also fails to take into account Indonesia's failing and collapsing infrastructure; and their inability to maintain the military resources that they have.

(It also has Australia's GDP at about 70% of this year's level - so this dates some of the info' it uses on there..).

As for the USA's "supercarriers", don't forget they also have two fixed 'carriers as well - Japan and Australia..


The site myron quoted is complete rubbish!

That is why is says that.
"Evolution is the process of change, from one generation to the next, of inherited characteristics. The microbiologists see it happening all the time, as bacteria evolve to beat the antibiotics that we have so painstakingly developed."

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Postby The Colonel on Sun Feb 10, 2008 11:55 pm

The future of the Royal Navy:

Our brand new STEALTH destroyers. (8 of them)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zevSwdt_FAI&feature=related

Our brand new, MASSIVE CAPACITY, STEALTH carriers. (3 of them)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIEQgBKXkME&feature=related
"Evolution is the process of change, from one generation to the next, of inherited characteristics. The microbiologists see it happening all the time, as bacteria evolve to beat the antibiotics that we have so painstakingly developed."

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Postby myron myron on Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:38 am

The Colonel wrote:The future of the Royal Navy:

Our brand new STEALTH destroyers. (8 of them)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zevSwdt_FAI&feature=related

Our brand new, MASSIVE CAPACITY, STEALTH carriers. (3 of them)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIEQgBKXkME&feature=related


"In 2007, the British confirmed plans for the largest and most advanced ships ever sailed by the Royal Navy."

"Future ships"? When will they all be built and when will they all be launched?

And I note they will be the largest and most advanced ships "sailed by the Royal Navy," a huge qualification.

Please. :lol:



"These 65,000 ton vessels will carry a vast compliment of aircraft, including the F-35 Lighning II."

So these "future" carriers are not supercarriers and will not be nuclear-powered, which means they will have limited range.

By comparison, the 10 American Nimitz-class nuclear-powered supercarriers presently deployed are 97,000 tons each, 50% bigger than the "future" non-nuclear-powered British carrers. Here's the real deal: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o50orb7jKAk

I guess "massive capacity" is a relative term. :lol:

The UK's "future ships" will carry the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II, an American airplane, eh?

And a "Stealth carrier" cannot be stealthy if the planes it carries are not Stealth planes. How many Stealth planes does the UK have presently deployed? Any at all? :wink:



Cute computer animations in your links though. :P


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